My emails are mark as spam on hotmail

Discussion in 'General' started by webcimes, Oct 28, 2019.

  1. webcimes

    webcimes New Member

    Hello,

    I have install recently a new server, with new IP and I have config all to have a good score for send mails.

    I use debian 10 and ISPConfig 3.1.15p2

    I have configure all (DKIM, SPF, DMARC, rDNS, HELO) my IP is not blacklisted, and I have try many test on "mail-tester.com" and I have a perfect score (10/10), https://www.mail-tester.com/test-a4kgt&reloaded=1

    So all my mails are send normaly to gmail / yahoo / sfr / 1&1 / ovh ... but not for outlook/live/hotmail where my mails go to spam I doesn't know why.

    I have try to go on Junk Email Reporting Program (JMRP) and Smart Network Data Services (SNDS) of outlook, and to contact hotmail but they just respond me this :

    So for me all my mail has comply with hotmail's technique standar like indicate https://postmaster.live.com/pm/postmaster.aspx and I really don't know what I can do better...

    Maybe you can help me for this problem or indicate me the good way ?

    Thanks for your advises
     
  2. Taleman

    Taleman Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    That makes me think the IP has sent spam to Hotmail sometime in the past, and it is blacklisted now for past offences. I guess it will eventually get removed from the blacklist if the sending of spam has ceased, but this may take time. Hotmail should offer some method to get IP removed from blacklist, otherwise using such blacklist leads to problems.
    What is strange Hotmail claiming they can not discuss blocks they place on IP-numbers. How does Hotmail plan to solve wrongly blacklisted hosts?
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2022
  3. webcimes

    webcimes New Member

    Thanks for your answer, you have probably right about the past of the IP, maybe I will try to get a new one.
    And for their answer I think like you I was really surprised that they can't help me to resolv the block "we do not have the liberty to discuss the nature of the block" so I don't understand the utility of their service..
     
  4. till

    till Super Moderator Staff Member ISPConfig Developer

    Get a new IP is what I would try too.

    I guess they are not permitted to discuss it to not allow spammers to circumvent their systems. That's basically as if you want to discuss with a google employee why your site has been downranked, you will not get an answer on such a question :)
     
  5. webcimes

    webcimes New Member

    I will try to get a new IP and I will see what is happening ..
    And yes I can understand that they probably have a lot of user who write on their services, but for compare with gmail and the other webmail their policy are very hard.. but fortunately they don't all do it like that.
    Thanks :)
     
  6. elmacus

    elmacus Active Member

  7. recin

    recin Member

    Hotmail is a pain. I think I never could get in his inbox
     
  8. webcimes

    webcimes New Member

    Thanks for your return elmacus, yes I see that the problem exist since a long time and many user is concerned. I will try to change my IP and if it doesn't work I will wait and see if, with the time, microsoft allow me to send mails .. :(
     
  9. Steini86

    Steini86 Active Member

    All Microsoft related email-services are crap. They block almost randomly and then you should take care of getting of their stupid blacklists. As long as users don't complain to Microsoft to not getting mails this will not change. You need some "score" with their system to be able to send mails. In the past I had a dummy account there and just sent mails via cron from and to that address to generate some traffic. Completely stupid, but it worked. The "funniest" thing about this is that I got the most spam to these dummy accounts which nobody knows about. Their spam policy is just total crap.

    Their Mail server is blocking legit mails and you have to take care of this. Strange world. They want you to:
    1) Look at this: https://sendersupport.olc.protection.outlook.com/pm/troubleshooting.aspx
    2) Use this: https://sendersupport.olc.protection.outlook.com/pm/
    3) Post your IP here: https://sendersupport.olc.protection.outlook.com/snds/JMRP.aspx?wa=wsignin1.0
    4) Sign in here: https://sender.office.com/
    5) If that does not work, contact them (as you did)
    6) You will get an automated email (~6h later) with: "As previously stated, your IP(...) do not qualify for mitigation at this time."
    7) Respond to their mail, saying that you already did what they suggest and their spam policy is crap.
    8) Either you are directly de-listed, or you need a second round via mail (usually, it is an automated mail, you can just reply the same as the first time, until a human answers)
    9) you will receive de-listing: "We have implemented mitigation for your IP: (****************) and this process may take 24 - 48 hours to replicate completely throughout our system."

    Sometimes you will receive something like "As stated previously, I do not see anything offhand that would be preventing your mail from reaching our customers for the following IP (xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx)." because they have different (but all crappy) systems for live/hotmail and MSN/outlook.com ...
    Just keep answering their mails until you get a human. Takes usually 3 days...
     
    webcimes and till like this.
  10. webcimes

    webcimes New Member

    Thanks you very much "Steini86" for your perfect lists, I will try all of this and after I will do a return :)
    Just one question for you, when you say that you have create a cron for sent mails to generate some traffic, you was sending mail from your domain to hotmail ? or from your domain to your domain ? How many mails you was sending every days ? And with the same subjet and message ?
    In any case thanks for all details of every steps !
     
  11. Steini86

    Steini86 Active Member

    I sent a mail every week from microsoft to my domain AND from my domain to the microsoft account. This can be done by hand, just make sure, it is no "spam". This is to build up reputation in their database. Completely stupid.. :rolleyes:o_O
     
  12. till

    till Super Moderator Staff Member ISPConfig Developer

    You should make a service out of it "Keep MS mail busy" or "The anti-spam Chatbot" :D ;)
     
  13. Steini86

    Steini86 Active Member

    Yeah, write a bot, which talks to the Microsoft bots ... Like this Ticket: https://github.com/buildo/react-components/pull/1367
    Opened by a bot, merged by a bot, commented by a bot, closed by a bot -> Not working. -> Bot denies reverting and closes the ticket ,..:rolleyes:
     
  14. franc

    franc New Member

    Sorry to "reopen" this old thread, but it seems neccessary:
    My small server was not accepted since very long by hotmail and all the other MS Mail domains.
    I was searching trying and fixing for many hours. Nothing. The form was sometimes successful, but then only for a day or so. After it was again the usual pain in the MS-ass.
    I began to avoid hotmail-addresses ("dont you have a real email address? what address is that, hotmail, is it a porn server?" - such stuff ;)
    Last week I searched again for "hotmail does not accept my mail server" or something similar. I found this thread and just for fun I sent an email to my hotmail address (yes, I have such a crap-address too, just for testing) and suddenly my mail was accepted!
    I could even send an email from commandline (with sendmail or mail or so) and this was in my spam folder, but not rejected as always before.
    What changed at MS? Did they at least check what crap they did? How bad this is for their reputation? At least I had a big anger about their mailserver crap and never ever recommended this but disapproved it with whoever I talked about.
    Thank you @Steini86 for your hints, anyway!!!
    Sincerely, francwalter
     
  15. pyte

    pyte Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    You will not get insight in how the Anti-Spam systems of these big providers work. I have these issues with customer mail an gmail.com, as some sending domains work just fine, some get flagged as spam and don't go into the inbox. These mails use the same mailserver and are perfectly valid with a 10/10 score. There are many things big providers may have in place, and we can only guess.
     
  16. Alex Mamatuik

    Alex Mamatuik New Member

    All, what i know, and how it was fixed for me with a gmail system' mails sent to...

    You have to add
    such records to dns-zone AAAA
    1. hostname - <name of your website>
    2. IPv6-Address - <your ip6 address>
    3. TTL - 3600

      +
    4. hostname - www
    5. IPv6-Address - <your ip6 address>
    6. TTL - 3600
    your /var/named/pri.site.com combination should be looking like:
    $TTL 3600
    @ IN SOA dns1.server.name. site.com. (
    2020052403 ; serial, todays date + todays serial #
    7200 ; refresh, seconds
    540 ; retry, seconds
    604800 ; expire, seconds
    3600 ) ; minimum, seconds
    ;

    subdomain 86400 A 1.2.3.4
    mail 3600 A 1.2.3.4
    site.com. 3600 A 1.2.3.4
    www 3600 A 1.2.3.4
    site.com. 3600 AAAA 123:c080:140:42a6:500:2ff:fe9e:f50
    www 3600 AAAA 123:c080:140:42a6:500:2ff:fe9e:f50
    site.com. 3600 MX 10 mail.site.com.
    site.com. 3600 NS dns1.server.name.
    site.com. 3600 NS dns2.server.name.
    default._domainkey.site.com. 3600 TXT "v=DKIM1; t=s; p=MIGfMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBAQUAA4GNADCBiQKBgQDV6kJha1eS++c5IZslupDKpSdmHjFQqlyNM+ZZ2g47qu6HMFvil9tO5hxwCKe8TWlFar11srHjnNGvJHCkBCbvCnDGjKu6ssiXOYqED4hPeskjsa/3APgCAvZgAx8whyXAyjmB1r6NKFNqKku0BqVKyxP2KHEOlEFNPBuicm6KnwIDAQAB"
    site.com. 3600 TXT "v=spf1 mx a ~all"
     
  17. pyte

    pyte Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    So adding the AAAA record for "@" and the AAAA record for "www" fixed the issue that mails are getting flagged as spam?
     
  18. Alex Mamatuik

    Alex Mamatuik New Member

    (don't be lazy) ;)
    just try!
    it had fixed for me all the problems with previously spammed e-mails to gmail.com addresses
     
  19. Alex Mamatuik

    Alex Mamatuik New Member

  20. pyte

    pyte Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    Sounds wild that these records should have anything to do with gmail flagging mails as spam. I just checked and the customer that has this issue with gmail has AAAA records set for the domain in question, so i guess maybe something else you've changed might caused the difference or it was just something on their side that changed over the time.
     

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